13 replies to this topic

[jonro]

Does anyone know what type of overlap there was between the lever fill Balance with the Lifetime nib and the Vac-Fil Balance with the Triumph nib? Where both of these pens sold at the same time, or were the lever fill models phased out as soon as the Vac-Fil was introduced to the Sheaffer line?

[Teej47]

Lever fillers were there right up until the Thin Models came along. I know the wire banded Craftsman pens (approximately '49-'51 or so) came in both Touchdown and lever fill, but don't know whether Triumph nibbed lever fillers were made alongside Touchdowns. "Vac-Fil" didn't replace lever fillers. Touchdown mostly did, but I think Snorkel/Tip-Dip ultimately own that distinction.

Tim

[jonro]

Among all the variations that people have found, I wonder if there are any lever fillers with Triumph nibs or Vac-Fils with Lifetime nibs.

[Pen Is Mightier]

I know I have seen lever fillers with triumph nibs before, if you do a search through google you can find evidence of them.

As for the vac fill with a lifetime nib there are some, I know I have one that is a military clip balance that is vac-fill and has a lifetime nib.

Hopefully this helps

edited: for spelling

[david i]

Does anyone know what type of overlap there was between the lever fill Balance with the Lifetime nib and the Vac-Fil Balance with the Triumph nib? Where both of these pens sold at the same time, or were the lever fill models phased out as soon as the Vac-Fil was introduced to the Sheaffer line?

Hi Jon,

I might be misreading the question, but to me the question suggests some core data errors

Balance has Lifetime nib when it is a high line Balance with White Dot. During era in which Sheaffer used plunger filler (Vac-Fil, Wire Pen) on Balance, essentially all pens were made with both fillers, thus Balance with LIfetime nib is found both lever-fill and vac-fill in Lifetime and non-Lifetime trim.

Vac-Fil Balance with Triumph nib is a self contradictory expression. All Balance by definition do not have Triumph nib, which was introduced with the Triumph pen 1942 after the last catalogue appearance of Balance in 1941.

Lever fill pens go back to the first Sheaffers around 1908, continued through the entire Balance era (1929-1941) even after the introduction of the vac-fill system as a parallel offering starting around 1935 for Balance, and indeed do appear (as a minority finding by far) during the WW-II era Triumph-family pens 1942-1945 and post war Triumph (and open) nib pens 1945 to at least 1948. I believe I've seen 1949-1950 Touchdown era pens still with lever filler as well.

All new models 1942-1945 were Triumph nib only, though it seems some of the low line pre 1942 pens (possibly some of the military clip "balances") continued as open nib offerings into the war years. The open nib was re-introduced to the 1940's-style pens, proper, during the post war celluloid era.

regards

david

[david i]

Lever fillers were there right up until the Thin Models came along. I know the wire banded Craftsman pens (approximately '49-'51 or so) came in both Touchdown and lever fill, but don't know whether Triumph nibbed lever fillers were made alongside Touchdowns. "Vac-Fil" didn't replace lever fillers. Touchdown mostly did, but I think Snorkel/Tip-Dip ultimately own that distinction.

Tim

Hi Tim,

We touch on a fairly complicated era, without yet too many published overviews.

LF and VF were made in parallel for the Balances from 1935-1941.

1942 saw the Triumph family (intro to the sheath nib). Most are VF but some LF still were made. These have Lifetime points, but tubular not open. Some left over 1940-41 style pens probably still were made, using the open point.

1945-1948 saw the post War pens (Valiant, et al). Most were plunger, but some levers were made. The Bead Band pens did have LF found more often.

regards

david

[david i]

Among all the variations that people have found, I wonder if there are any lever fillers with Triumph nibs or Vac-Fils with Lifetime nibs.

Hi Jon,

Again Lifetime nib is not exclusive of Triumph nib.

See my first response above

I will try to post a general timeline next few days. Too, see the pen-open shot of the Masterpiece (in that thread) I will post in few hours. It is a Lifetime Triumph nib.

regards

d

[jonro]

Thank you, David. You've cleared up a lot of my questions with these posts. I wonder if part of the reason for the overlap in filling systems in the same style pen was to see people preferred the Vac-Fil, the first big change in filling mechanisms for Sheaffer, to the venerable lever fill. I can see them offering tubular nibs with both Lifetime points and Triumph points since not everyone might take to the new curved end of the Triumph nibs.

Regards,

Jon

Hi Tim,

We touch on a fairly complicated era, without yet too many published overviews.

LF and VF were made in parallel for the Balances from 1935-1941.

1942 saw the Triumph family (intro to the sheath nib). Most are VF but some LF still were made. These have Lifetime points, but tubular not open. Some left over 1940-41 style pens probably still were made, using the open point.

1945-1948 saw the post War pens (Valiant, et al). Most were plunger, but some levers were made. The Bead Band pens did have LF found more often.

regards

david

[david i]

Thank you, David. You've cleared up a lot of my questions with these posts. I wonder if part of the reason for the overlap in filling systems in the same style pen was to see people preferred the Vac-Fil, the first big change in filling mechanisms for Sheaffer, to the venerable lever fill. I can see them offering tubular nibs with both Lifetime points and Triumph points since not everyone might take to the new curved end of the Triumph nibs.

Regards,

Jon

Hi Jon,

Again, in casual usage a Triumph nib is synonymous with a tubular nib, so saying "tubular nib with Triumph point" is redundant as in "I have a red flower that is red". Not sure if I'm missing something here...

We don't know why Sheaffer opted to make two fillers in parallel for years in pens otherwise at same price point and tier. Wahl did the same. Parker in a 1936 Parkergram poked fun at them for doing so, pointing out that its own Vacumatic pens defined a higher niche than its old fashioned non-transparent pens. I'm not sure they'd have been doing both styles of filler as some sort of test marketing of the concept as this went on for 6+ years. My (unproven) suspicion is Sheaffer and Wahl wanted to jump on the "clear barrel" train, without letting go of their tried and true product.

regards

david

[matt]

[quote name='david i' date='13 July 2011 - 06:28 PM' timestamp='1310603319' post='7507']
< The open nib was re-introduced to the 1940's-style pens, proper, during the post war celluloid era.>/quote]

David, post war open nibs are on non-white dot pens only, correct? 23 on Cadet and Minerva, 33 on Craftsman and Diana, and Feather Touch 5 on the Admiral. Then later, large Lifetime (at first) then non-Lifetime open nibs on 875 Admiral and Lady Tuckaway which lost their "79" sheath nibs, white dots, and bead bands, but picked up the "Statesman" 1/4" capband.
Not complicated at all!

[matt]

Among all the variations that people have found, I wonder if there are any lever fillers with Triumph nibs or Vac-Fils with Lifetime nibs.

If you mean post war pens, you're talking my kind of fun!

Vac-fil w/ Lifetime nib:
Watch for non-WD vac-fil pens, both Tuckaway and full size that have a 1/4" wide "Statesman" cap band. These are late 875 Sovereign and Lady tuckaways that have lost their "79" sheath nibs, white dots, and bead bands. They have large two-tone open Lifetime nibs (later ones have non-Lifetime open nibs.) Very common in tuckaway on ebay.


Lever fill Triumph nib:
There are lever fill white dot Statesman pens with "79" sheath nibs that, according to Kirchheimer, are cataloged only in black, but can be found in striped colors. I won a brown one on ebay recently. These are easy to spot as they have a metal thread ring, same as the vac-fil. AND the sections are screw-in, with triple-lead threads so you can line up the nib w/ the lever.

Same thing with lever fill Sentinel 1250 and the larger Sentinel Deluxe 1500 - all seem to be black, however.

The Crest 1500 and Crest Deluxe 1750 are both LF and VF, brown stripe or black only; don't know if there's a brown stripe LF.

The Autograph 2000 is both LF and VF. Only cataloged in black, but IIRC Gerry Berg has a brown vac-fil.

The early post war Admiral 500 can be found with a "59" sheath nib in both lever fill and vac-fil. For some reason, the nib on the LF is monotone while the VF has a two-tone nib. (Later Admirals have FT 5 nib and are LF only.) I've not yet found a Milady, which is a VF tuckaway-length pen w/ a 59 nib and a full length clip.

[david i]

Snip
The Autograph 2000 is both LF and VF. Only cataloged in black, but IIRC Gerry Berg has a brown vac-fil.
SNIP

Hi Matt,

My Autograph in brown stripe is- i believe- documented by Sheaffer as is black.

regards

david

[jonro]

Is there a difference between the conical Lifetime and Triumph nibs besides the inscription? I had been thinking that the Lifetimes all have a straight tip and the Triumphs have the curved tip, at least during the postwar years. However, looking through photographs indicates that this isn't the case.

[david i]

Is there a difference between the conical Lifetime and Triumph nibs besides the inscription? I had been thinking that the Lifetimes all have a straight tip and the Triumphs have the curved tip, at least during the postwar years. However, looking through photographs indicates that this isn't the case.

Hi John,

The original pen to house the "Triumph" nib was... the Sheaffer Triumph. Best I can tell, the nib eventually took the name from the original pen to house it; the pen did not take its name from the nib.

Arguably, all the tubular nibs can be called Triumph nibs, noting that I'm not sure I've seen the term used for some of the later (~ 1960) short tubular nibs used on pens such as Lady Skripsert.

The upwardly curved nib, seen starting with Balance in the mid 1930's is a Sheaffer feature, one Richard would have us describe as "Waverly" based on that company being apparently the first to make that sort of bend to the nib. There is no correlation in my experience (such as it is) with the tips of the conical/tubular nibs curving upward specifically on either Lifetime-marked or non-Lifetime-marked examples. All are "Triumph" independent of Lifetime markings or presence of that "waverly" upcoved tip.

regards

david