21 replies to this topic

[FarmBoy]

I'd be interested to see info regarding a non-12 size 6xy pen or for mottled Waterman overlays.

Where is this "mottled 615" pen located? I'm assuming it is not yours...

regards

david

Not mine David,

I was just looking on the internet and came across this. I dont quite understand what you mean by " info regarding a non-12 size 6xy pen or for mottled Waterman overlays?"

Do you know Hank or did you just borrow the picture hoping to purchase the pen after an evaluation?

Also how did you run across the picture if not on FPN? My search skills are not so well developed.

I was looking for a RHR 12, and trying to find going prices, and that's when i stumbled upon that beauty.

What is your price range? I could likely scare up a RHR Waterman 12.

[david i]

Again, I'm a bit disturbed by some of the caginess in tone to the posts inquiring about these pens. It is not hard to do some research these pens when they are mentioned, and probably it is good to share goals.

Too, I caution those new to the hobby to be careful assuming they can buy and flip/trade pens owned by advanced collectors. That can be a minefield, though one not impossible to navigate.

Anyway, beyond the very questionable "Waterman 615, mottled", we seem to be addressing the Waterman Red Hard Rubber #`12.


Some prior comments on RHR #12 from FPN 2009

Don Lavin: Assuming that the cap does not have any hairline cracks in the lip or worse, chunks missing, and if the barrel is undamaged, the pen is worth several hundred dollars.

David Nishimura: RHR Waterman eyedroppers are VERY scarce, and in fact a RHR 12 is less common than the equivalent pen with a silver filigree overlay. Although it has been done, it has never been a common procedure to take a plain RHR 12 and put on an overlay from a regular 412 over BHR -- if for no other reason than the extreme difficulty of finding a plain RHR 12 in the first place!

The similar switcheroo that WAS done quite commonly in the late 1980s and 1990s was to take a RHR 52 and put on a Filigree overlay from a regular 452 over BHR. The resulting pen was a bit of a fantasy model, however: unlike the 412 over RHR, which was a regular, catalogued model, the 452 over RHR was never catalogued, and there is some doubt whether ANY of the examples extant are factory-original. I believe a handful of originals do exist, judging from finds in the wild, but the numbers are incredibly small. In any event, the Cardinal 52 is not that rare a pen, so it made much more sense to "upgrade" it with an overlay than the much, much scarcer RHR 12.

In any event, great caution is a must when considering any Waterman in RHR with an overlay. There are more fakes than genuine examples -- overwhelmingly so with lever-fillers! -- so be sure to get an expert opinion before putting your money down. Although I must note that there are an awful lot of veteran collectors and dealers who can't tell the difference . . . .

David Nishimura A RHR Waterman ED is emphatically not a user pen -- too fragile, too valuable.
The Cardinal 52 is a different matter, as it is both more robustly built and much less valuable.

Here is an image borrowed from the Lott Brothers over at Five Star Pens, of sold pen that asked $800+

Regards

david