68 replies to this topic

[Tennpen]

Ive got a rare Waterman 'World's Smallest Fountain Pen' which id be interested in trading. Please email me at XYZ, as i dont come here very often. Best Regards,Brandon

my favorite quote ever.......

Just curious if the rare Waterman "World's Smallest Fountain Pen" was offered to you before or after a discussion a few weeks ago about a similar pen? That pen had everything except a nib, feed, section, and intact cap.

[brando090]

Ive got a rare Waterman 'World's Smallest Fountain Pen' which id be interested in trading. Please email me at XYZ, as i dont come here very often. Best Regards,Brandon

my favorite quote ever.......

Just curious if the rare Waterman "World's Smallest Fountain Pen" was offered to you before or after a discussion a few weeks ago about a similar pen? That pen had everything except a nib, feed, section, and intact cap.

This was months ago, and the pen has since been told.

[George]

A Summary:
I sold David a duofold demo.

Months after the sale of the demo to David, I get a message from Brandon asking me if I am interested in selling/trading the demo, because he saw a picture I posted of it here on FPB. In the reply to the inquiry, I lied and said I still had it, and I would be open to offers. At this time, David is the owner of the duofold demo.

Recognizing a deal, Brandon in turn tries to sell David's OWN PEN (the duofold demo) to... David. It should be noted that Brandon did not own, nor did he ever posses the duofold demo. Or the AA Waterman in our conversation, or the Parker 51 Prototypes.

Funniness follows.

Regards,
George

[JonSzanto]

[david i]

The money shot in this thread indeed is my question for Brando, already touched on in this thread by George,

Brando, are you aware that the pen (Duofold Demonstrator) you were "offering" to sell me, one you had not identified as not your own, one whose photo was not yours, actually was my pen, in my possession at length?

How do you feel trying to sell someone his own pen?

Isn't that a little weird?

I would feel weird if I tried that with someone.

I wonder if anyone else here as ever tried to sell a pen to someone when the target of that sale already actually owned the pen in question.


For fun, here is Brando's email from June 21, 2012

Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2012 12:11 PM
Subject: Re: Re: Pen Trade

David,

Here are some Parkers which we could work out, and the Duofold Demonstrator in Bakelite (i think);

'

Here is a thread about this very pen I offered to FPB, six months earlier, January 2012.

http://fountainpenbo...d-demonstrator/

Like, man, what are the odds?


regards

-david

[brando090]

Wow, am i dumb or what. Talk about the pen community being small

[sloegin]

That is the only thing you have learned from this thread? Really?

[FarmBoy]

Wow, am i dumb or what. Talk about the pen community being small

Yup, pretty small. You would be surprised to know the spread of information when it comes to such topics.

[Rick Krantz]

Unbelieveable....

Words simply escape me.

This borders on criminal

[david i]

Ive got a rare Waterman 'World's Smallest Fountain Pen' which id be interested in trading. Please email me at XYZ, as i dont come here very often. Best Regards,Brandon

my favorite quote ever.......

Just curious if the rare Waterman "World's Smallest Fountain Pen" was offered to you before or after a discussion a few weeks ago about a similar pen? That pen had everything except a nib, feed, section, and intact cap.

This was months ago, and the pen has since been told.

That was one month ago, or, in other words, a few weeks ago, not months ago.

Here's the thread. Note the issues that appeared there too.

http://fountainpenbo...t-fountain-pen/

regards

david

[Tennpen]

The money shot in this thread indeed is my question for Brando, already touched on in this thread by George,

Brando, are you aware that the pen (Duofold Demonstrator) you were "offering" to sell me, one you had not identified as not your own, one whose photo was not yours, actually was my pen, in my possession at length?

How do you feel trying to sell someone his own pen?

Isn't that a little weird?

I would feel weird if I tried that with someone.

I wonder if anyone else here as ever tried to sell a pen to someone when the target of that sale already actually owned the pen in question.


For fun, here is Brando's email from June 21, 2012

Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2012 12:11 PM
Subject: Re: Re: Pen Trade

David,

Here are some Parkers which we could work out, and the Duofold Demonstrator in Bakelite (i think);

'

Here is a thread about this very pen I offered to FPB, six months earlier, January 2012.

http://fountainpenbo...d-demonstrator/

Like, man, what are the odds?

regards

-david

Wow, am i dumb or what. Talk about the pen community being small

"Pathologically clueless"* seemed appropriate at the time of original posting. Maybe a new description is needed?

*Credit due to the original poster of this term. Excellent!

[Jerry Adair]

Brando
Buy a book, buy several books Paul Eranos book, Fishlers and Schnieders book, Glen Bowens book, Frank Dubiels book, The 51 book, the Waterman book, Cliff Lawrences book the Swan book There are dozens more. They are filled with information read them, study them learn. Got to a pen show, go to several pen shows and do please say please
Jerry

[brando090]

Brando
Buy a book, buy several books Paul Eranos book, Fishlers and Schnieders book, Glen Bowens book, Frank Dubiels book, The 51 book, the Waterman book, Cliff Lawrences book the Swan book There are dozens more. They are filled with information read them, study them learn. Got to a pen show, go to several pen shows and do please say please
Jerry

Jerry,

I really would love to read up on these books, but ive been significant reduced from buying pens, as i dont sell on ebay anymore. I have a list of books i want to buy, and i just dont have the funds to do so. The Max David Waterman book is at the top of my list, along with books regarding smaller Italian and German pens, such as The Chronicle of the Fountain Pen. Would it be possible for me to "check-them-out" from you? And ill return them...

[Teej47]

I'd been impressed by David's patience for some time, but now that I have the full Paul Harvey treatment... well, I'm amazed.

Tim

(If you don't get the Paul Harvey reference you're really not old enough to be sitting at the grownup table.)

[brando090]

Brando
Buy a book, buy several books Paul Eranos book, Fishlers and Schnieders book, Glen Bowens book, Frank Dubiels book, The 51 book, the Waterman book, Cliff Lawrences book the Swan book There are dozens more. They are filled with information read them, study them learn. Got to a pen show, go to several pen shows and do please say please
Jerry

Also Jerry,

As far as pen shows, when i get a car (~2-3 months, BMW) id really like to go to the Chicago, Ohio, Detroit, and DC shows. Hopefully you guys will welcome me to dinner, please, and wont give me too much of a hard time.

[Tennpen]

Brando
Buy a book, buy several books Paul Eranos book, Fishlers and Schnieders book, Glen Bowens book, Frank Dubiels book, The 51 book, the Waterman book, Cliff Lawrences book the Swan book There are dozens more. They are filled with information read them, study them learn. Got to a pen show, go to several pen shows and do please say please
Jerry

Also Jerry,

As far as pen shows, when i get a car (~2-3 months, BMW) id really like to go to the Chicago, Ohio, Detroit, and DC shows. Hopefully you guys will welcome me to dinner, please, and wont give me too much of a hard time.

Hmmh! Money to buy a BMW, (even if it might be used,) and then travel, and not enough to buy any books on a subject you are so involved in? Interesting!

[brando090]

Brando
Buy a book, buy several books Paul Eranos book, Fishlers and Schnieders book, Glen Bowens book, Frank Dubiels book, The 51 book, the Waterman book, Cliff Lawrences book the Swan book There are dozens more. They are filled with information read them, study them learn. Got to a pen show, go to several pen shows and do please say please
Jerry

Also Jerry,

As far as pen shows, when i get a car (~2-3 months, BMW) id really like to go to the Chicago, Ohio, Detroit, and DC shows. Hopefully you guys will welcome me to dinner, please, and wont give me too much of a hard time.

Hmmh! Money to buy a BMW, (even if it might be used,) and then travel, and not enough to buy any books on a subject you are so involved in? Interesting!

Jerry, really...

It's a diesel which get's 30-40 mpg. This particular model is cheaper than alternatives, and you do want me to come visit you at a pen show, dont you?...

[david i]

Also Jerry,

As far as pen shows, when i get a car (~2-3 months, BMW) id really like to go to the Chicago, Ohio, Detroit, and DC shows. Hopefully you guys will welcome me to dinner, please, and wont give me too much of a hard time.

There probably has been no one to pop up on the boards in years to have so earned a hard time. When you start to realize why, you will have at least a hope of moving in new direction. It will be up to you if you want to grow


You have a remarkable lack of perspective regarding our hobby.

You think you can offer Sheaffer Cadets against 1930 Parker Combos, and you plan to attend a pen show in your BMW, but you cannot afford any pen books to start the process of learning about your chosen hobby. You offer pens for sale you don't own. You've been tossed from ebay already and now say you "don't" sell pens on ebay anymore. Why not? Can't? Your account seems active. Of course this is your second ebay account and your first sale on it gave you a negative feedback because you refused to ship the pen you'd sold. You fish for information to hunt imaginary trades and are more than a bit grandiose in assessing items you own. You post "perspectives" that are loose paraphrase (often with errors) from other more knowledgeable writers, yet you don't mention you didn't come up with the notions in play. You really have created your own "hard time".

Selling some of your pens to buy a couple good books would seem to be a good thing for you long term.

Jerry's advice to you is startlingly similar to what others offered you when you first popped up. You show no signs of having absorbed any of that advice during the last few months. Perhaps you'll hear it better, when it is from Jerry.. You have alienated many (perhaps most) of the well known internet pen dealers and advice sharers. A remarkable feat.

Go sell a few pens. Take the appropriate losses on your "deals". Buy Erano's $25 book and the $80 Fischler "Blue Book". Perhaps promise yourself not to buy any pens the next few months. Check out pen profiles at Nishimura's and Binder's websites. Ask questions without second agenda and go at it long enough that people actually believe (correctly or not) that you want to learn, not just manipulate. You might be surprised...

regards

d

[brando090]

Also Jerry,

As far as pen shows, when i get a car (~2-3 months, BMW) id really like to go to the Chicago, Ohio, Detroit, and DC shows. Hopefully you guys will welcome me to dinner, please, and wont give me too much of a hard time.

There probably has been no one to pop up on the boards in years to have so earned a hard time. When you start to realize why, you will have at least a hope of moving in new direction. It will be up to you if you want to grow


You have a remarkable lack of perspective regarding our hobby.

You think you can offer Sheaffer Cadets against 1930 Parker Combos, and you plan to attend a pen show in your BMW, but you cannot afford any pen books to start the process of learning about your chosen hobby. You offer pens for sale you don't own. You've been tossed from ebay already and now say you "don't" sell pens on ebay anymore. Why not? Can't? Your account seems active. Of course this is your second ebay account and your first sale on it gave you a negative feedback because you refused to ship the pen you'd sold. You fish for information to hunt imaginary trades and are more than a bit grandiose in assessing items you own. You post "perspectives" that are loose paraphrase (often with errors) from other more knowledgeable writers, yet you don't mention you didn't come up with the notions in ply. You have You really have created your own "hard time".

Selling some of your pens to buy a couple good books would seem to be a good thing for you long term.

Jerry's advice to you is startlingly similar to what others offered you when you first popped up. You show no signs of having absorbed any of that advice during the last few months. Perhaps you'll hear it better, when it is from Jerry.. You have alienated many (perhaps most) of the well known internet pen dealers and advice sharers. A remarkable feat.

Go sell a few pens. Take the appropriate losses on your "deals". Buy Erano's $25 book and the $80 Fischler "Blue Book". Perhaps promise yourself not to buy any pens the next few months. Check out pen profiles at Nishimura's and Binder's websites. Ask questions without second agenda and go at it long enough that people actually believe (correctly or not) that you want to learn, not just manipulate. You might be surprised...

regards

d

Sorry i didn't know Parker combo's are scarce, and compared to most of the 3rd tier combo's, Parker combo's fetch a premium. I have owned several pen books, but they were pretty much on the history of the brand, not exactly anything of depth an detail. Obviously, as you should know David Issacson, im only a teenager, so that my hint regarding ebay. Ebay doesn't like young entrepreneurs, i think they like 200 year old entrepreneurs, who knows anymore!

Also i do a lot of trades, working on 3 as we speak, one of which will be ending this week, and another ill be visiting to do the trade. I also appologise for asking question in which i wasn't sure of a brand and it's value, id rather ask an expert, than try to sell it on ebay for $15000.

Edited by brando090, 04 October 2012 - 08:54 PM.

[david i]

Sorry i didn't know Parker combo's are scarce, and compared to most of the 3rd tier combo's, Parker combo's fetch a premium. I have owned several pen books, but they were pretty much on the history of the brand, not exactly anything of depth an detail. Obviously, as you should know David Issacson, im only a teenager, so that my hint regarding ebay. Ebay doesn't like young entrepreneurs, i think they like 200 year old entrepreneurs, who knows anymore!

Also i do a lot of trades, working on 3 as we speak, one of which will be ending this week, and another ill be visiting to do the trade. I also appologise for asking question in which i wasn't sure of a brand and it's value, id rather ask an expert, than try to sell it on ebay for $15000.

As is typical, you miss the point, and offer straw-man apologies.

I certainly don't object to your not knowing about Parker Combos or about anything. In fact, those who know nearly nothing but want to learn constitute a major demographic for whom this Board was created.

Rather, it is presumption that is the objection. A "style" thing, not a "knowledge" thing. And, it is not about making "an" error in this regard, it is about a pattern of, well, ludicrous discussion of trades, the pattern including the offering of weak material to senior collectors in exchange for strong material. Many have tried to give you advice on this. You seem not to get it. There is no harm in not knowing values. But, class and perspective would have you offer items and ask what they'd be worth to someone, not start out with offers that are instantly off-putting to those who can (and for others, often do) offer constructive guidance in the hobby.

Being called out for trying to sell someone what turns out to be his own actual pen using a picture that is not yours should not provoke, "boy I'm silly. the community really is small". Rather it should lead to, "yeah, I appear to be seriously lacking in sound business ethics and must try to change my ways".

Your comments about ebay of course are nonsense. You managed to activate accounts, and manage it seems to screw them up in short order. And, many young folk manage to sell well with their relatives' accounts, because they don't screw up the feedback of those relatives' accounts via bad business practices. Food for thought, right?

Good luck with those trades. Maybe after six months of doing trades, you'll manage to earn enough then to buy the most basic of books?

And, I actually do agree with you. Books are not enough. Collectables hobbies have apprenticeship components to them. One cannot just read a general (or even specific, in most cases) book, and be ready to rumble with the pros. But, then, most rank apprentices in the farm leage do not posture as if they are playing in the big leagues.

Ignorance (in the literal, non-pejorative spin) is no evil.

Dishonesty, manipulation, irresponsibility, presumption... those won't serve you well in the long run.

And, yeah, I realize you won't quite "get it".

regards

d