39 replies to this topic

[grandmia]

Above is another Onoto pen review, however can anyone tell us what the numbering system means ?

[Jim B]

To answer that, we'd have to watch your video! and they are usually way too long. If you have a technical question, just ask it -- don't make people have to watch your videos.
You must be getting paid for utube eyeballs or something --if that's the case, put up some pen porn, you'll get more eyeballs,

Edited by Jim B, 23 January 2013 - 07:15 PM.

[Jim B]

Here's some Moth porn so you can get the idea!

 IMG_0286.JPG   86.77KB   14 downloads

[grandmia]

To answer that, we'd have to watch your video! and they are usually way too long. If you have a technical question, just ask it -- don't make people have to watch your videos.
You must be getting paid for utube eyeballs or something --if that's the case, put up some pen porn, you'll get more eyeballs,

Nobody is making you watch any videos, you have to click on the link to watch ! And why would you have to watch the video to answer a simple question ?

I have asked " Does any one know the meaning of Onotos numbering system" ?

[grandmia]

Here's some Moth porn so you can get the idea!

 IMG_0286.JPG   86.77KB   14 downloads

Nice moth ? Sorry but i do not get it ?

[opus7600]

Nice moth ? Sorry but i do not get it ?

If I may jump in here, I believe what Jim is saying is that he finds videos to be an inconvenient method of taking in your review, and his preference would be for you to write words and take pictures. He also implying that he does not believe others are watching your videos for the same reasons he does not. There are a few other reasons, besides pleasing Jim and hypothesized others, that you might want to consider writing a review instead of shooting extemporaneous video:
1) A written review is unaffected by accent. Not that yours is necessarily bad, just a general issue.
2) A written review can be run through an online translator, for any non-English speaking pen lovers who want to learn more.
3) A written review can be edited. Of course video *can* be edited, but not everyone has the software or knowledge for that.

You do seem to enjoy making videos, maybe you could do yourself and others a service by writing up your planned transcript first. You could then post the transcript for everyone to read, which would make Jim happy, and it should help tighten up your presentation style, maybe eliminate a few of those extra phrases you throw in to fill time while you're thinking ("if you like", "Ladies and gentlemen", "ehm", "actually", "I hope you can see this" and "as you can see").

I'll provide some examples of how others have made combination video/written reviews for you:
http://fpgeeks.com/2...-whalers-sepia/
http://www.inknouvea...u-shin-kai.html

Edited by opus7600, 26 January 2013 - 10:55 AM.

[Deb]

Much vital information was irretrievably lost when De La Rue premises were bombed in World War II which means that the Onoto numbering system remains an uncracked code to a great extent. Crook, Hull, Marshall and Oldfield have produced some excellent guidance to it in the Onoto Pen Repair book. I'm not going to reproduce that here because I believe that would be unfair to the work they have done and would go beyond "fair use". The book is still available; I suggest you get it - it offers a great deal more than just this information. More elucidation on numbering is sure to follow. Stephen Hull is working on an Onoto book and he has a track record of unearthing just that sort of information, as he did with Swan pens some time ago. The present-day Onoto company has no connection with the historical De La Rue Onoto company and they have no special knowledge of matters relating to the history of the original company.

[Jim B]

Thank you Opus7600 for making my points more eloquently than I could muster.

I can absolutely vouch for the Onoto repair book, an inexpensive ( $8-10 iirc) guide with a wealth of information.

Lastly i point to a cool Onoto I recently acquired -- Solid 9K rose Gold, Barleycorn pattern, very early plunger with a gold accomodation clip, and cool over-and-under feed with the feed encased in a gold sheath. Please see my Onoto Album.

sorry I couldn't make a Utube video of it-- no time.

Edited by Jim B, 26 January 2013 - 09:03 PM.

[Deb]

That's a really splendid pen, Jim B.

[grandmia]

Nice moth ? Sorry but i do not get it ?

If I may jump in here, I believe what Jim is saying is that he finds videos to be an inconvenient method of taking in your review, and his preference would be for you to write words and take pictures. He also implying that he does not believe others are watching your videos for the same reasons he does not. There are a few other reasons, besides pleasing Jim and hypothesized others, that you might want to consider writing a review instead of shooting extemporaneous video:
1) A written review is unaffected by accent. Not that yours is necessarily bad, just a general issue.
2) A written review can be run through an online translator, for any non-English speaking pen lovers who want to learn more.
3) A written review can be edited. Of course video *can* be edited, but not everyone has the software or knowledge for that.

You do seem to enjoy making videos, maybe you could do yourself and others a service by writing up your planned transcript first. You could then post the transcript for everyone to read, which would make Jim happy, and it should help tighten up your presentation style, maybe eliminate a few of those extra phrases you throw in to fill time while you're thinking ("if you like", "Ladies and gentlemen", "ehm", "actually", "I hope you can see this" and "as you can see").

I'll provide some examples of how others have made combination video/written reviews for you:
http://fpgeeks.com/2...-whalers-sepia/
http://www.inknouvea...u-shin-kai.html

Hello Deb...Thank you for your comments. You may not want to watch my videos, that is up to you thankfully its a free world ( in most countries ) . My videos are not scripted or choreographed what you see is what you get with warts and all. Some people prefer to write about a pen, i prefer to video pens so viewers can actually see the pen. Videos i feel show all the details of a particular pen where as someone writing about the pen does not show me what the pen looks like.There is more than enough room for the written reviews as well as video reviews. So everyone to there own, plus we are in the 21st century and with the power of social networking, and social media which is here to stay i feel sharing videos is a better way of showing my pens.

I received lots of messages from people who enjoy my videos and i enjoy making them. At the London pen show recently i had a number of total strangersapproach me and thanked me for uploading the videos. One gentlemen only recognised me because he heard me talking to someone and recognised my Northern accent which i am proud of and make no apologies for.
Therefore as i prefer to video as opposed to writing, and as long as ( some ) people are enjoying them then my videos will continue.

Regards Stef.

[grandmia]

Much vital information was irretrievably lost when De La Rue premises were bombed in World War II which means that the Onoto numbering system remains an uncracked code to a great extent. Crook, Hull, Marshall and Oldfield have produced some excellent guidance to it in the Onoto Pen Repair book. I'm not going to reproduce that here because I believe that would be unfair to the work they have done and would go beyond "fair use". The book is still available; I suggest you get it - it offers a great deal more than just this information. More elucidation on numbering is sure to follow. Stephen Hull is working on an Onoto book and he has a track record of unearthing just that sort of information, as he did with Swan pens some time ago. The present-day Onoto company has no connection with the historical De La Rue Onoto company and they have no special knowledge of matters relating to the history of the original company.

Hello Deb.


Yes i am aware of all this but with this being a open forum i thought members may share there knowledge with other members....

Thanks Stef.

[grandmia]

Thank you Opus7600 for making my points more eloquently than I could muster.

I can absolutely vouch for the Onoto repair book, an inexpensive ( $8-10 iirc) guide with a wealth of information.

Lastly i point to a cool Onoto I recently acquired -- Solid 9K rose Gold, Barleycorn pattern, very early plunger with a gold accomodation clip, and cool over-and-under feed with the feed encased in a gold sheath. Please see my Onoto Album.

sorry I couldn't make a Utube video of it-- no time.

Hi Jim

What a cracking pen, that would look great in my collection.

But, this is a good example were i would love to see more of this pen in as much detail as possible. The two photos although very nice leaves me wanting to see more of this pen, therefore a close up video of this pen would satisfy my interest in vintage Onoto pens. So for me personally and i am sure i would not be the only one, a video review of this pen would be great. I'm not concerned of any accent you may have or your vocabulary, in fact you could even show a silent video for all i care as i am only really interested in that beautiful pen.

Regards Stef.

PS If you ever get fed up with your pen, give me a shout.

[Deb]

Hello Deb.


Yes i am aware of all this but with this being a open forum i thought members may share there knowledge with other members....

Thanks Stef.

I'm glad you're aware of all that. The solution to your problem must be clear for you. Buy the book!


The knowledge is not mine to give. I'd be plagiarising someone else's work if I copied all that out here for you. I've no idea what you think an open forum has to do with that.

[grandmia]

Hello Deb.


Yes i am aware of all this but with this being a open forum i thought members may share there knowledge with other members....

Thanks Stef.

I'm glad you're aware of all that. The solution to your problem must be clear for you. Buy the book!


The knowledge is not mine to give. I'd be plagiarising someone else's work if I copied all that out here for you. I've no idea what you think an open forum has to do with that.

I was under the opinion that forums are for helping others were we can ?

If you have knowledge, let others light their candles with it. Winston Churchil (1874-1965) British politician.

Stef.

[Deb]

Stef,

I'll be happy to give you any knowledge that's mine, or to pass on anything that's in the public domain. What I can't do is give away what someone else has published without their permission to do so. I would have thought that after a few repetitions this would have become clear to you, but you seem to be determined to be obtuse about it. Or are you too tight-fisted to buy the book?

Maybe I'll make a shaky, rambling YouTube video about it for you...

[grandmia]

Stef,

I'll be happy to give you any knowledge that's mine, or to pass on anything that's in the public domain. What I can't do is give away what someone else has published without their permission to do so. I would have thought that after a few repetitions this would have become clear to you, but you seem to be determined to be obtuse about it. Or are you too tight-fisted to buy the book?

Maybe I'll make a shaky, rambling YouTube video about it for you...

Hello Deb

The only thing that is clear to me is how rude you can be. Therefore i will now refrain from replying to your comments.

Thank you for your input.

Regards

Stef.

[Deb]

Hello Deb

The only thing that is clear to me is how rude you can be. Therefore i will now refrain from replying to your comments.

Thank you for your input.

Regards

Stef.

You're right. I was rude. I apologise for that. However, you did provoke me by refusing to accept my unwillingness to comply with your wishes. There's a simple, straightforward ethical issue here that anyone can understand: It would be wrong of me to hand over the fruit of someone else's hard work without their permission. You're welcome to my knowledge and opinions - rambling and half-thought-out as they generally are - and I dispense them freely in my blog most days. I've said elsewhere that the pens have to cost money; the knowledge should be free, but that's my rule for myself. If someone else commits their valuable time to digging up the history of a pen company for our benefit, and makes a publishing venture of it, that's an admirable thing to do. For me to go handing it out in paragraphs and chapters on the web would be no more or less than theft of their work, and that's hardly likely to encourage the next person to devote themselves to the betterment of our hobby.

[PatMorgan]

Deb I think it is wonderful that you are choosing to not compromise what you feel would be unethical to do.

[PatMorgan]

You have 2 suggestions to buy the book and suggestions for you to do the research. I think that is quite informative for you and way is lighted for you should decide to walk that path. But wanting someone to compromise their ethics for your gain, well I think it is important that quoting Churchill to induce guilt (if that is your intention, if not then I apologize but that is how it looks to me and perhaps you might rethink your quoting in the future so it does not look that) so you can get information that one feels it is not place to share, well, for me does not come across as great.

People share what they feel is proper for them to share. Some offer the knowledge freely, others feel compensation is warranted. Sometimes education is free, sometimes there is a price for it.
Deb has chosen to share with you the book and the name of another author. She has chosen not to further compromise the research done by another but advised you where you can gain more knowledge. For me, a good answer if I were the person addressed in the message would be thank you and then asking the pen community where I can get the book and perhaps at a good cost.

Up to you how you wish to come off.

Hello Deb.


Yes i am aware of all this but with this being a open forum i thought members may share there knowledge with other members....

Thanks Stef.

I'm glad you're aware of all that. The solution to your problem must be clear for you. Buy the book!


The knowledge is not mine to give. I'd be plagiarising someone else's work if I copied all that out here for you. I've no idea what you think an open forum has to do with that.

I was under the opinion that forums are for helping others were we can ?

If you have knowledge, let others light their candles with it. Winston Churchil (1874-1965) British politician.

Stef.

[Hugh]

Deb I think it is wonderful that you are choosing to not compromise what you feel would be unethical to do.

I agree.

Regards
Hugh