89 replies to this topic

[FarmBoy]

I understand that the PCA material is now accessible for free to members and non-members.

I also believe that was the desired result.

I'm not clear why there needed to be a civil war to get there.

[david i]

Hi Todd,

 

Dunno how the PCA is offering downloads now. For such a big organization, it does seem to spend a weird amount of time reacting (to me?) rather than proacting, or something.

 

I didn't know of a civil war there.  Has there been internal brawling?  I'm usually up on this stuff. Perhaps not this time though. Do share.

 

The download I offered has the advantage of being single-click, not requiring 600 separate downloads, each of which does take some time. Perhaps the PCA will offer in fashion I have. Reacting again...

 

There is more to discuss, and I do not avoid it, but probably cannot set up a good and proper thread-- though this one is evolving interestingly-- until done with my two week work cycle.

 

Weird thing is, it was the uncivil nature of the Voice of the PCA that triggered this cascade.

 

regards

 

david

[Rick Krantz]

John Jenkins will be missed. I hope in time he has time to reflect and will join us again. 

 

I am more than willing to give new material to David to further the free download archive (it really needs a name) 

 

Roger, in addition, I will make sure the PCA gets it as well. 

 

Just need to get this stuff into work and scan it. I promise to make that happen. .

 

I can't be happier for the success of the Journal, it should be recognized what just happened there in 8 months, pretty incredible. 

[FarmBoy]

I was referring to the pen collecting community as a whole with respect to civil unrest.

I see talk in various circles about promoting the hobby as a whole. Unfortunately the discussion usually takes the opportunity to put other clubs/forums/list serve/social media/etc is less than stellar light. Many examples abound.

I should have been more clear and not implied the PCA is divided, I have no knowledge of the inner workings or of management changes within the PCA.

[david i]

Decisions leading to contention are a not uncommon element to the politics even of a hobby.  Before making Big Decisions (look at our lawmakers), it always is good to consider outcome and unintended consequences.

 

regards

 

-d

[david i]

Rick, you might like the name. More on that later.

 

-d

[travberg]

Given that I've only played in the pen community for 25 years, with a 5 year disappearance. The PCA was an organization that I had multi year membership, but for lack of relevance or compelling reason, I have not rejoined. Like it or not, this web site has a truly knowledgeable and interesting group of participants.

I lack the history or knowledge of the Penant, PCA, and Paul Erano's new publication, (which I receive). I find it hard it to believe that anyone could have serious disagreement with Paul. For my 25 years, I have always been treated with courtesy and kindness by Paul. As far as David, I was there when he was a deer in the headlights for his first major show. I enjoy our pen deals and our social time! I seek them both out at shows, look forward to our time together, and hope for many more years. Paul and David have and likely will make major contributions to the pen community.

I am open to rejoining the PCA, just don't know why I should?

[david i]

Weird that it was Brandon Cefani in his latest incarnation who accidentally referred me to a FPN thread relevant to this topic, shockingly (shocked am I) locked already.

I do find it unfortunate that people feel the need to explain what my friend and PCA Prez Ron Zorn really means, as if his words don't stand on their own. Are those people his friends?

 

-d

[Ron Z]

I do find it unfortunate that people feel the need to explain what my friend and PCA Prez Ron Zorn really means, as if his words don't stand on their own. Are those people his friends?

 

The person in the thread you are referring to is David Nishimura.  He is indeed my friend, a man soft spoken and tactful, something that I often am not.  I appreciate his wisdom, and consider it a privilege to have him working alongside me as Vice President.  As a matter of fact, I asked him to consider running for the board of the PCA because I knew what he could bring to the organization.

 

I like the board that we have, and respect them all.    I'm honored to work with them.   Welcome to Roger as our new Librarian.  That is a big job, and he volunteered to take it on, eyes wide open!   I look forward to getting to know him better.   Thanks to John Jenkens for all of the hard work that he put into the library, even building a framework that allows scanning documents without risk of damage to the often delicate paper.   It was a labor of love for many years, worthy of honor and respect.

[david i]

Good to see you peeking in, Ron.

 

So, you didn't mean then what you said?

 

Fair enough.

 

It happens.

 

Other David certainly is a friendly acquaintance...  or at least we do seem to well play that role on line. I don't presume to know what other people think, but I do appreciate the david-david  interaction on FB and here, and that's no joke.

 

Perhaps you should join our Facebook group. You can avoid all the other FB stuff easily enough. Think Pentrace and Zoss rolled into one, with very little drama, lots of pens, and lots of opportunity for pen dealers and restorers.

 

regards

 

david

[david i]

Next week I will start a more formal thread on this. Will release the honorary name of the collection.

 

I'm just too busy this week.

 

-d

[david i]

Facebook FPnuts group.  Vintage-focus, but modern/ink/etc not discouraged.  Sales and website updates appreciated, in moderation. 3050 members and growing. So far-- aside from sunglasses and alien baby spam--  only one thread deleted for having no pen content and being nothing but ad hominem attack. Low key, as they say.

 

You will have to log in to facebook to see the group. Sorry, I can't help that. It's from facebook.

 

Link to Fountain Pen Facebook Group.

 

regards

 

David

[Hugh]

 

I do find it unfortunate that people feel the need to explain what my friend and PCA Prez Ron Zorn really means, as if his words don't stand on their own. Are those people his friends?

 

The person in the thread you are referring to is David Nishimura.  He is indeed my friend, a man soft spoken and tactful, something that I often am not.  I appreciate his wisdom, and consider it a privilege to have him working alongside me as Vice President.  As a matter of fact, I asked him to consider running for the board of the PCA because I knew what he could bring to the organization.

 

I like the board that we have, and respect them all.    I'm honored to work with them.   Welcome to Roger as our new Librarian.  That is a big job, and he volunteered to take it on, eyes wide open!   I look forward to getting to know him better.   Thanks to John Jenkens for all of the hard work that he put into the library, even building a framework that allows scanning documents without risk of damage to the often delicate paper.   It was a labor of love for many years, worthy of honor and respect.

 

 

Wise and welcome words.

 

Regards

Hugh

[Jerry Adair]

Hugh

Do you know Jon Veley?  If not, how do you know his move to PCA editor was an error?  I happen to know both Jon and Paul quite well.  As a matter of fact just got a note from Paul with one of his "Penman" sketches thanking me for a favor I did for him.

I too agree with John Jenkins re the downloading of the data from the PCA website.  Regardless of the "ownership" of the documents John Jenkins and others worked very hard to collate the catalogs and other writings and to just grab them because you can is probably legal but most certainly unethical without their permission.  You may not agree with me but I personally could not care less.  Unlike John I will not stop posting here but I am taking a stand and will be counted among those who deplore this act.  If Dave Armstrong is the guy from Canada, I was looking for him at the Michigan Pen Show last year and wanted to discuss with him his take on those documents.  He did not come in with the group of guys from Canada, who are all first class collectors by the way. 

If this position ostracizes me from this list so be it but it is essential to me that I take a stand.

Jerry

[Roger W.]

Jerry;

 

I appreciate where you are coming from.  I think Dave Armstrong merely found where someone else had downloaded a bunch of catalogs and brought it to everyone's attention - I'm not sure he had anything to do with the downloading hence people pointing the finger at David.  I don't believe David had anything to do with the downloading either.  Problem is once the catalogs were digitized it is very easy to share the files.  I worried about someone making copies of my catalog reprints and selling them on their own.  This would have taken some effort and doesn't seem to have been done but, no matter, most everything is digitized now.  I think the only function for the PCA Library is to centralize everything to a place that will outlive us all.  I also see the PCA being a body that people would be glad to share ephemera with knowing that is going to be shared for research.  I think the PCA and John Jenkins should be given credit for their efforts but, I also think that it should be expected that this information can be easily widely shared.  The PCA is a non for profit and sharing information is what it is all about so it should be a leader in that cause.

 

Roger W.

[david i]

Brief Note. Hospital nuts. Reminder that next week I'll offer a formal thread addressing (and inviting comments of course) on the subject at hand.

 

Jerry, in all this,  your comment hurts my feelings the most, only because you invoke ostracization  (sic) as some hidden threat from this board.  I'd have thought you knew better and also that you weren't confusing us for FPN, where the squelchification (sic) of conversation is common.

 

First, objecting to one of my positions here probably puts you in good company with the majority of people who play here. I don't know why you would fear being ostracized from the community, when your position is shared by many here.

 

Second, if you actually meant banned/purged/expunged, as if by Administrative fiat, then you don't know this Board very well

 

I like contrary views to show up.  Nearly nothing and no one has been purged here. Indeed, Veley is the gift that keeps giving (if the PCA wants, say, smallpox), and he is welcome to post here.  Why would you be worried?

 

 

Please, guys, don't suggest here that you will be dumped for failing to  maintain some "party line".

 

Few things are absolute, but I hope by now I've given people confidence they can write without fear here.

 

regards

 

d

[Jerry Adair]

David

I know I would not be kicked off.  Heck I've been thrown out of better places than this.  Seriously though, you know that I was one of the first to get involved with the PCA Paul Erano Cluster F.  I talked at length with both Lisa and Paul that same day and for some time was not satisfied with the answers I was getting.  You also know that I was one of the first subscribers to  Pauls magazine but I also stayed with PCA because I felt then and still do that it is an essential contributor to our hobby, passion, fixation, disease or whatever it is that motivates us to posses these bits of plastic, rubber and gold.  There is room for both publications and as long as I am breathing I will subscribe to both.  My point was that the PCA team put in a ton of work and it was appropriated without their permission or consent and people made light of it as if it were a big joke.  Some individual from Canada seed to be driving the bus.  I know a bunch of those guys but he was an unknown to me and still is. John Jenkins burned a lot of midnight oil to put that package together and essentially got crapped on by party or parties as yet unknown to me.

 God knows (and I don't believe in god) I didn't intend to hurt your feelings.  You and I go way back and I certainly like you as a person and respect your knowledge contributions and enthusiasm.  Remember I once drove from Shorewood Illinois to some unknown restaurant to have a pen club meeting with you, probably 200 miles round trip. 

Anyway I am still here and will be for the long haul.  Perhaps if the gods permit I'll see you in DC

Jerry

[david i]

Hi Jerry,

 

All good.  There will be more comments by me (and likely others) about the PCA debacle. You are welcome to views on the matter. Some I'll agree with, others not. That's cool. As long as people know they are welcome to post from all perspectives, I'm content.

 

regards

 

david

[david i]

And, I was being a bit exaggeratory (sic) about hurt feelings.

 

-d

[david i]

And, flippancy aside, I actually did give the PCA a chance to disavow and apologize for Veley's hateful speech. The PCA was not interested.

 

-d