Thanks for the comments on my pen. A certain Italian man keepa many beauties like this pen in a spa in Tuscany, I was fortunate to have swept this one up to muggy Texas.


Don't worry, if you're the crazy Aussie / Ulsterman, you are welcome in my threads!

Since I started collecting vintage Italians, one of the the things I've learned is that the rules are very different from American pens. When we find an American pen with a nib of another manufacturer, we either assume "frankenpen", or that there was a repair somewhere along the way. In either case, the pen is considered flawed and un-original.

With Italian pens, I'm finding pens that clearly were sold with nibs from other brands - I'm assuming a jeweler replaced the nib perhaps for a different writing characteristic for a particular user. My latest experience with this was at DC (some of you might have seen this pen) - a GF Omas pen with The King nib in it (The King is not a sub-brand of Omas). The owner of the pen swears this pen is untouched since it was presented as a wedding gift.

I've got other such examples that I no longer attribute to a mid-life replacement nib. I just don't know.

Marc

Ciao Marc,
this is a THE KING in mervellous conditions (i think...)

I forgot my promise, but I took some photos of the original version I own.
They are not so good, but they are good enough to be published.


This is a selection, you can find the full gallery (and also the high resolution versions) here:

http://www.fountainp...:Nettuno_Photos

Simone

GREAT PEN SIMONE !!!!!

<br /><br /><br />

That was almost 10 years ago (probably more), so I don't think it still will possible to get one at that price. Nettuno are hard to find anyway, and in Italy we don't have big pen show like the ones in the US or in Germany.

I'm from Florence so I'm quite interested in Tibaldi, but in more than 15 years collecting I just found one outside pen shows. Usually you find some Tibaldi model (let say one or two) in pens shows, but for the Infrangibile it's almost three year that I cannot see any one. I saw a Superba last year and this year also. But I go just to some of the pen show (I'a collector, not a seller) so perhaps I'm just unlucky.

Regards
Simone

Ciao Simone,
it's a plesaure to mee here!!!
We live in Tuscany, but we met in a usa forum!!!!
For you and all one TIBALDI in my collection

Hi Fabbale,

Thanks for joining the Board. While the site is hosted in the USA, I suspect I speak for many saying that international pen discussion is very welcome. I fear I do not know very much about vintage Italian pens, but I am happy to learn.

The Stipula Nettuno pens in my picture (Superba and Idra) are near modern pens (late 1990s I believe) done by Stipula in the style/tradition of Nettuno, the defunct pen company. I guess that makes them replica, although I do not know that Netunno made pens of this original shape. My recollection is that the celluloid used was old stock from decades earlier. I am not certain of that.

Is there a good book to learn about old Italian pens... a book in English?

-david

Ciao David, thank for your info.
In Italy, during the last years several books are made, some also in english.
I think that for you the better book is :



Are 2 books that examine all production and it's the Opera Omnia about italian vintage fountain pens; it's write in italian and english.
Letizia is a friend of mine and if you need a copy i think that's possibile ask her.
Other important books:

If you need some information about italian pens, let me know. I'll be happy to help you.

Hi,

I usually focus on old pens from the USA (and related international divisions), but I have a few modern pens and a few old pens from abroad. Early in my collecting, I did stumble upon the Stipula Nettuno editions. They had quite a "vintage" look, even to me, who at the time had only been into old pens for a bit. I ended up owning both Superba and Idra. While these are not vintage Nettuno pens, proper, they are rather nice. I finally had chance to shoot them (been very busy month),and now offer the images here. I would like to see images of true vintage Nettuna pens, never having seen one before.

Anway, the Stipula versions...

regards

David

Hi David
this set in wooooow!!!!

I've never seen a Stipula like this; the Nettuno is a vintage or a replica?

FB

That's a very interesting and attractive barrel pattern evoking woodgrain. Is that celluloid?

Tim

Yes, in Italy this pattern is called CELLULOIDE ARCO.

Milan firm Koska is one of the many fountain pen manufacturers that were set up by business people from Germany on Italian soil after the turn of the century,Montegrappa, Uhlmann’s, and Fendograf are just a few examples.

Business between Italy and Germany in the writing instrument industry was always brisk, but from the late twentiesthrough the early forties trade grew enormously. German pens were exported to Italy, where many were enhanced with the application of metal overlays. But large German companies also supplied Italian producers with raw materials (hard rubber, casein plastic, and celluloid), metal parts (clips, filling mechanisms, and trim), and nibs. Besides selling in Italy, many finished products were exported from Italy for sale on the German market. While Koska was based in Via Perugia, Milan, the date it was established is not known. The features of the earliest Koska pens, however, would suggest that the business began production in the second half of the twenties. But it cannot be ruled than this.

The name Koska derives from the first syllables of the owners’ surnames: Koheler and Schaefer, which give “Ko-scha.” This was simplified to “Kosca,” possibly because Italians would have pronounced “Koscha” as coscia, that is, the Italian word for thigh.



Like other firms with German origins, Koska quickly established itself on the market with its production of metal parts and precious metal overlays. And this was the sector in which Koska was most successful, soon becoming regarded as the benchmark for quality overlays by many Italian compagnie During the thirties/early forties Koska made precious metal overlays for Columbus, Omega, Ercolessi, and the Italian branch of Waterman. And in the fifties it expanded its clientele to Parker.

Pens made during the second half of the thirties are more standardized. Available in three sizes, they have a more solid and robust design. The cap trim consists of a band with geometric guilloche decorations set between two thinner bands. Koska definitively adopted a clip with a “faceted” tip during this period with the name “Koska” engraved on it. This clip was also widely used on safety pens with metal overlays (some marked “Koska,” others not) and many overlays made for other firms.

info from

Thank you all. Very interesting what you think about the quest for originality and perfection or be on leave everything as is.

I need info about this RED SHEAFFER.

It's an oversize, flat top, 7-30 nib, no white dot.

The color is a vivid red, no orange or other (se wtih other Sheaffer)

It's a LOANER???

Here is my nurses set with the 2 bands. Not showing much wear except for age. No one is going to walk off with this ladies pen set

Another nurses set like this in leaher pounch.
Not good condition and unfortunately no thermometer and good photo !!!!

Thanks David
good news for me.

FB

I'm interested to know your opinion about this pen.
I've not seen a lot Wahl in this color and i think that is very beauty.
The box is correct for this item???

Thank

This time no mobile phone, I'm at home and I can use a digital camera...
So here some photos, renmant of many attempt...








You can also find the full resolution versions at their wiki page, here, here, here, here, here, here and here

Wooooooow Simone.
This is a great surprise!!!

FB

This is an instance where provenance would be informative.

If it could be established that several black and pearl Dorics had been found "in the wild" in central Italy, one might hypothesize that, in addition to the examples given in the USA to salesmen, some were used as export models. There are certainly parallels, where production variations not sold in the USA (or distributed in extremely limited numbers) were sent to other countries.

On the other hand, I suspect that with the black and pearl Dorics, there is another backstory. In the later 1980s and first half of the 1990s, a huge number of vintage US pens made their way to Italy. Italian collectors were buying nearly every pen they could get their hands on, paying several times the US collector price. Italian dealers came to US pen shows and bought whole tables of pens at a time; American dealers brought suitcases full of pens to Italy. In this virtual torrent of pens, some very rare examples were bought without any awareness of their being anything special. To give just one example, I remember selling a bandless Duofold Senior to a dealer in Rome who happily paid my asking price, but then asked if a band could be put on it! At least I spoke Italian, and could explain why this was not a good idea, but most of the foreign sellers active in Italy didn't speak much Italian at all. It seems most likely that the black and pearl Dorics under discussion came to Italy under similar circumstances, some 15-20 years ago

Hello David, interesting what you say. Among other things, I bought you some pens during a Pen Show in Siena can not remember on what date. Were you one that came with suitcases full of pens??

• Congratulations on your find. I am very familiar with this pen having owned this model. This Doric, as has been pointed out, was not a catalog or production item. The plastic is leftover stock from the Deco Band era but Wahl found a way to use the material in a special way - the pens I have seen were given by Wahl to successful salespeople. Most I have seen have an engraving on the barrel with the recipients name. Your pen appears to have only the initials on the clip.

At the Chicago Pen Show a few years ago, one of my pen friends brought one of these pens to the show for show and tell. His story was fantastic. Apparently his pen was given to the Thomas Alva Edison, who was in a hospital just prior to his death in 1931, by a friend of his who acquired the pen from Wahl directly. Edison accepted the pen graciously but never used it. Instead he gave the pen to the Dodge family (yes Dodge automobiles) where the pen remained. In my collecting career of over 40 years I have owned one oversize and one standard size and I have only seen maybe 5 oversize models. So the pen is very scarce if not rare. Don

Interesting story.
Thanks to you for your opinion.

FB

Wow... I didn't know to own a such unique Doric. I know it was a rare color, but not that it was so much rare. Mine has a #9 Adjustable Nib and no engraving and no box. I'll try to take some pictures, but I'm very bad taking photos. What's strange it's to find two of these rare pens in such a short distance in Italy: we both live in Tuscany... Simone

The Power of the Tuscan

Sassicaia wine .... Florentine steak .... extra virgin olive oil ... and now, in the menu also Doric B&P.

American friends are waiting for you in Florence.

PS Let me see your Oversize; send me a photo taken at the mobile phone.

Yes the cap is certainly from a later model.
But the combination is not so bad.

Simone

Quote my friend Simone for the mix cap/body, but, GOOD SENSATIONS & GOOD VIBRATION for color.

Very, Very ok.

Un po' scolorita, ma mica brutta.

Perfect terminology David.
Or you speak Italian very well or your online translator works fine:lol:

Wow, color is not so bad. I think I have a spare Tibaldi nib, so will you sell me that pen? Simone

Sorry Simon, but I found a NANNELLI in Bologna Pen Show with a nice nib Tibaldi !!!!! Welcome back over here as well.

Tibaldi in one of the must brand that italian collector's looking for.
In this example, is a INFRANGIBILE item. (UNBREAKABLE in english)

Is a set in not good color and the nib is not originale, but all, is must rare.

Enjoy.

Nice, rare pen!
I will try to post pictures on my large gold filigree pen later...but silver is by far more rare, especially since it is in the oversize.

Thank Jiffy
I'm waiting yours gold filled oversize.

FB

Most Morrison filigrees are gold filled. Silver is much less common.

Yes David, i know...
I want to say in this size.

How about this big Morrison's filigree?
Nib has not its original, but rather, a beautiful Griesabher.
Was produced also in gold filigree?

With a 452

The pen is an Aurora. The Novum was one of the premier models for Aurora in the 1930's.

This is a beautiful pen. Looks like the pen has the twist lever mechanism.

The NOVUM models were famoud for your lever filler at the end of the barrel

For some beautifull color

For a particular safety clip not in all models