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Sheaffer Tuckaway. History and Photos. More to come...


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#21 BrianMcQueen

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Posted 18 December 2011 - 11:52 PM

Wonderful thread.
Finally I might get an ID for this. My wife's parents gave it to her as a graduation gift.
Based on Greg's photos, and DI's list, is this an Autograph? Are visulated section a standard element?


I don't know the exact model, but it is not an autograph pen. Autographs have wide solid 14k bands and are marked 14k.

#22 david i

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Posted 19 December 2011 - 02:45 AM

Thanks, David. Revised per your suggestion. But what about the section?


Gripping section is part of the "painful evolution" of 1945-7, and one I did not specify in the model list. Pens seemingly early to this era have transparent barrels and matching striped gripping sections. Seemingly later pens in this era have opaque barrels and visualated secitions. There are some transitional findings out there to the barrels as well. Too, for this model, you have what we believe to the later wider cap-lip variant.

regards

david
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#23 david i

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Posted 19 December 2011 - 06:13 AM

Great thread and some great photos, but this one is causing me to do a lot of digging and sorting. Attached is the first of several photos I hope to post that will build, I hope, on Greg's post and show how diverse the Tuckaway product line. David's listing shows how difficult it is to cover the various models, let alone the models in all the colors, and then some of the models have different price imprints which must have reflected the effect of inflation during that era. The attached photo shows the diversity in just a few of the colors.

BTW - if anyone has a brown plastic Stratowriter cap that would work on the Strato barrel in the top row, please let me know.

Pat


Hi Pat,

Thanks for joining the discussion and for offering those killer spreads.

At risk of getting maudlin or philosophical, how grand is it to have a forum and threads that can provoke/motivate those of us with advanced collections to have to go digging and sorting? It is this sort of thing that was a core goal at FPB. Not every thread hits that bell, but many do. And, the collections serve us better when they are put to use. :)
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#24 david i

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Posted 19 December 2011 - 06:13 AM

David, you started an afternoon project for me as I've spent most of it rummaging through and sorting Tuckaways, and I've only gotten part way.

Attached is a shot of black Tuckaways which once again shows the variation among the different models. As with the earlier tray I posted, there are no duplicates on this tray, even though there are some very subtle external differences, particularly if one compares the bands on the pens and pencils on the top right where, for example, the second and third in from the top right have the same band and appear to be the same except the second in has no white dot and the third in has a white dot on the top of its cap. Once opened, the pen without the white dot has a flat nib and the pen with the dot on its top has a triumph nib.

In the bottom row, the 3 on the right have 14K trim but I recommend people look at Greg's more complete shot of those.

In my experience, the black with chrome trim on the bottom left are pretty tough to find.

Pat


It's all good.

As a slight mod to my last note, one goal of this Board no doubt was to motivate those of us with advanced collections to find afternoon projects in bringing information to light. We're living the dream... ;)

Yes, there are many nuanced evolutionary tweaks to be found, particularly 1945-7 era. There can be diminishing returns to their pursuit, though that is subjective. It's one thing to want a pair of 1945-7 Valiant Tuckies, one with clear barrel, striped section and large band and perhaps one with "later" opaque barrel, clear section and narrow band version. But, what of the many that pop up that mix the two sets of features. Does one need four post-war Valiants in each color to cover all the ground? That of course ignores the partially-clear barrel pen, maybe found with both caps. Six pens total now? Eep! What of a truly opaque barrel vs what I'm told are some painted-interior opaque barrels... And so forth.

And, yeah, with the 25 or so key models/variants listed above, some found in up to five colors, I didn't even touch on pencils and ball points.

Fun stuff.

-d
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#25 david i

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Posted 19 December 2011 - 06:17 AM

SNIP

and then some of the models have different price imprints which must have reflected the effect of inflation during that era. The attached photo shows the diversity in just a few of the colors.

SNIP


Hmmm... about this I am not certain.

There were some price jumps from similar models from different eras (using my would-be categories from the list), but I'm not sure prices from one model evolved during a given style run. Crest Tucky did not shift price during the war-years, per se, or during the post-war celluloid years, per se... iirc.

regards

david
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#26 david i

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Posted 19 December 2011 - 06:22 AM

Just so as not to lose the eye candy element of this thread...

Here is a 1945-7 (post-war, celluloid era) Valiant Tuckaway in rather nice shape. The narrow band probably is slightly later production than the wider band seen on some pens.


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Here is an earlier (still same era) Carmine set showing the wider band, matching gripping section, and transparent barrel. Not so shabby either.


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Another shot of one of my first-style Tuckies. This one with a quite uncommon matching case

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And... the instructions that came with the boxed first style pen.

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regards

david
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#27 david i

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Posted 19 December 2011 - 06:26 AM

One thing I notice from these photos is how varied the placement of the White Dot was on Tuckaways. I realize part of this was size, as well as some non-clips. Were there any other model lines that had that much variation in where the dot was placed?




Hi Jon,

I have not done a hard review of Tuckaway White Dot positioning.

For some Sheaffer series, even for dots placed in same general area, there seem to be some variation in size and location (relative to top of cap, clip, etc). Some might represent era-evolution (1930 Balances with different dot spot vs 1940), or perhaps at some point even the hand-made nature of the product. I do not know.

There are cases of Tucky's white dot having signficant location variation, such as at very top of cap vs just above clip for some generally similar pens.

regards

david
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#28 david i

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Posted 19 December 2011 - 06:35 AM

Oh, and I do agree with Pat that the war-era "reverse trim" pens (black pens with chrome trim instead of the more commonly seen gold-filled trim) are relatively uncommon. I have a soft spot for reverse trim, spilling into Sheaffer collecting from my Vacumatic focus. I grab 'em when I can.

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regards

David
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#29 JonSzanto

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Posted 19 December 2011 - 07:18 AM

Thanks, David, for the "dot thoughts". This thread is illuminating as to how wide a range of product the Tuckaway was, something that, frankly, has caught me by surprise.

#30 ogwen

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Posted 19 December 2011 - 11:30 AM

Wow! I'm loving all these pics and the info is just terrific! Made me root around in my collection ...

My first pen was a Tuckaway (see avatar) and I just love them. This is my collection so far (but I swear I must have more somewhere! lol):
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My favorite is the Carmine Wideband Triumph, but I'm very fond of this set:
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Not just because the chromium is immaculate, but because inside the box, not only was there an inscription, the original stickers were in there as well:
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These pens in general hold up so well that I sometimes forget how old they really are.

- Jody

#31 PatM

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Posted 19 December 2011 - 04:26 PM

David -

I think we agree that Sheaffer imprints often included numbers indicating the price of the pen or pencil, e.g., 1000 = $10.00. Attached is a shot, albeit not that skillful, of imprints on identical Sheaffer Crest Tuckaways in blue. Both have identical caps, triumph nibs and white dots on the bottom of the barrel (end of the blind cap). The bottom pen has a 1500 imprint and the top has 1750.

The only difference I can find between the two is that the 1750 pen has about a 1/4" portion of its section which is visualated while the section on the 1500 pen is solid. We probably can't be sure why the price seems to have gone up on the seemingly same model, i.e., input cost increases, smart marketing, etc., but it does appear that prices did rise on the same model. I welcome other views on what might have been going on.

Best,
Pat
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#32 david i

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Posted 19 December 2011 - 04:46 PM

David -

I think we agree that Sheaffer imprints often included numbers indicating the price of the pen or pencil, e.g., 1000 = $10.00. Attached is a shot, albeit not that skillful, of imprints on identical Sheaffer Crest Tuckaways in blue. Both have identical caps, triumph nibs and white dots on the bottom of the barrel (end of the blind cap). The bottom pen has a 1500 imprint and the top has 1750.

The only difference I can find between the two is that the 1750 pen has about a 1/4" portion of its section which is visualated while the section on the 1500 pen is solid. We probably can't be sure why the price seems to have gone up on the seemingly same model, i.e., input cost increases, smart marketing, etc., but it does appear that prices did rise on the same model. I welcome other views on what might have been going on.

Best,
Pat


Hi Pat,

On tip of tongue I don't have emphatic answer, though I have suspicion (which itself, if wrong, will serve only to mislead), and with 1947, 1948 and 1949 catalogues on hand, I should be able to pin some of this down.

First, though it might be misdirecting, is to inquire as to whether both your pens are same era. Both are Forticel (injection plastic), but is one plunger fill and one Touchdown? At least then we would have slightly different eras in play, though a legit price bump would still be interesting.

Second, my recollection (at moment a bit vague I admit), is that while the 1945-7 celluloid full length gold-fill cap pens were found as Crest (1500) and Crest Deluxe (1750), that the Tuckies tend to pack the 1750 imprint from that era.

Your pens are later, either 1948 if plunger fill or 1949-50 if TD. If the 1945-7 Crest Tucky was 1750 coded, I would be a bit surprised to see price drop back then bump back up all within a couple years 1948-50.

Third, I'm bit surprised to see an opaque section on a Forticel pen pen. During the celluloid era the sections had become transparent. That continued through 1951 TM Touchdown, though Snork in 1952 returned to opaque sections. I'm not sure what to make of an opaque section on your pen. I'm open to ideas.

Finally, I do wonder about cap swap. Assuming I'm right that Crest Tucky had a $17.50 price by 1947 (pre injection plastic), I note that Sentinel had a $15.00 price, and that a Crest cap on Sentinel barrel (steel cap pen) if from same era would have white dot in same place, the price anomaly... and so forth.

Of course, I could be wrong and maybe there was some price hanky panky.

regards

david
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#33 matt

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Posted 19 December 2011 - 05:09 PM

But what about the section?

Ohhh, I can answer that one (and yes, your wife's set is a Tuckaway II).
Below, the first 4 pens are my view of the chronology of vac-fil sections.
1. Lady Tuckaway, striped section glued into the barrel, clear barrel stripes. These pens fill directly into the barrel. On unambered pens, you can see the section stripes through the clear barrel stripes.
2. Sentinel Tuckaway, visulated section, 3/8" clear barrel stripes, remainder of barrel interior is painted black. This pen, and the next two, fill into an internal tube. (Gerry: this has a 1250 price code, white dot on the butt, and I have the matching pencil. Did Sentinel tuckys come in grey stripe?) The barrel screws over the internal tube as shown by the visible threads in the barrel window. In the right light you can still see the clear barrel stripes even on internally painted black pens - the Tuckaway II my father received for his high school graduation, for example.
3. non WD Lady (875 price code) Tuckaway w/ visulated section, open nib, and "Statesman" cap band. Still has clear barrel stripes, but entire barrel interior is painted black. Note the wide black barrel stripes.
4. non WD Lady Tuckaway. Opaque barrel. Skinny black barrel stripes, same as the cap.
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Striped sections also occur on vac-fil open nib pens such as the Diana, #5 above. Lever fill open nib pens, such as the Craftsman, #6 above, can get really odd - half stripe/half visulated section, with a vac-fil thread ring. And the section is threaded, not slip fit. The half stripe/half visulated threaded section can also be found on lever fill Triumph-nibbed full size pens, especially the Statesman...but this is a Tuckaway thread.

Edited by matt, 20 December 2011 - 03:26 AM.


#34 david i

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Posted 19 December 2011 - 05:23 PM

SNIP

. Sentinel Tuckaway, visulated section, 3/8" clear barrel stripes, remainder of barrel interior is painted black. This pen, and the next two, fill into an internal tube. (Gerry: this has a 1250 price code, white dot on the butt, and I have the matching pencil. Did Sentinel tuckys come in grey stripe?)


SNIP


Note, that if 1945-7 Sentinel Tucky (have not to check if also a Sentinel Deluxe Tucky) did turn up with $12.50 price, then my point to Pat regarding $15 vs $17.50 Crest Tuckaway is a bit more hazy. Still not sure there were $15 injection-plastic era Crest Tuckies, all perhaps being $17.50, but I need to research this more.

-d



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#35 david i

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Posted 19 December 2011 - 05:28 PM

SNIP

The half stripe/half visulated threaded section can also be found on lever fill Triumph-nibbed full size pens, especially the Statesman...but this is a Tuckaway thread.


Hi Matt,

I note that lever fill war-era Triumph (and related pens) have that half-and-half gripping section. I wonder if there are other similarities. Could there have been left over stock of parts as war-era Triumph ended and post-war bead-band began...

regards

david




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#36 PatM

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Posted 19 December 2011 - 06:17 PM

David -

Both of the blue Crests are plunger fill.

Pat

#37 matt

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Posted 19 December 2011 - 07:40 PM

Hi Matt, I note that lever fill war-era Triumph (and related pens) have that half-and-half gripping section. I wonder if there are other similarities. Could there have been left over stock of parts as war-era Triumph ended and post-war bead-band began... regards david


David, half striped/half clear section on a lever fill war-era Triumph? Can you show such a critter? My wartime "Triumph" Lifetime collection consists of a whopping 4 pens, all vac-fil. First of all, the sections are much shorter than post war pens, and second, as shown by this July 27, 1942, LIFE ad - that shows a lever fill (only in black, unfortunately) "Triumph" Lifetime - the visulated area is BEHIND the thread ring. These pens are also skinnier than post war models. Lever fill military clip pens have the traditional black/visulated section.

pgs 48-49:
http://books.google....triumph&f=false

also see page 2 in Nov 23, 1942, LIFE for same black pen
http://books.google....triumph&f=false

lever fill Vigilant in August 24, 1942 LIFE, pg 2
http://books.google....triumph&f=false

(edited to clean up mess left by outdated browser on work computer. grrr.)

Edited by matt, 20 December 2011 - 03:10 PM.


#38 david i

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Posted 19 December 2011 - 07:52 PM

David, half striped/half clear section on a lever fill war-era Triumph? Can you show such a critter? My wartime "Triumph" Lifetime collection consists of a whopping 4 pens, all vac-fil. First of all, the sections are much shorter than post war pens, and second, as shown by this July 27, 1942, LIFE ad - the only ad I know of that shows a lever fill (only in black, unfortunately) "Triumph" Lifetime - scroll down to pages 48-49 - the visulated area is BEHIND the thread ring. These pens are also skinnier than post war models. Lever fill military clip pens have the traditional black/visulated section.


Could be the ring divides regions. Just had recollection of the clear + color. Will hunt the pen.

d
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#39 david i

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 03:31 AM

Hi Matt,

Looks like one of your links was mangled by the Boardware. Happens sometimes. Maybe repost that one link?

regards

d
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#40 david i

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 04:35 AM

OK. Update Model List and Comments for Tuckaway 1940-1951






Pre War: 1940-41 (Both have open nib. Both have no clip. Both have flush cap)

1. Tuckaway (all gold-filled, open nib, threaded tush)
2. Masterpiece Tuckaway (sold gold. style as per Tuckaway)

WWII-Era: all 1942-5 (All have Triumph nib. All have no clip. All have flush cap)

3. Triumph Tuckaway (plastic pen. Gold-filled very wide lip. 5 colors)
4. Triumph Crest Tuckaway (plastic barrel. Gold-Filled Cap. Black and Brown barrels)
5. Triumph "Autograph" Tuckaway (plastic pen. Solid gold very wide cap lip. Black alone)

Post War Celluloid Era: 1945-7. (All have clasp type clip. Wide lip and bead band variants)


6. Tuckway Autograph (Plastic Pen. Gold Clip and Band. Possibly done in all five colors. Solid gold trim. Plastic pen)
7. Tuckaway Crest (gold-filled cap on plastic barrel. Triumph nib. Black and Brown)
8. Tuckaway Sentinel (brushed steel cap on plastic barrel. Triumph Nib. Black/Green/Carmine)
9. Tuckaway Valiant (
plastic pen gold-filled trim. Triumph Nib. Five Colors)

10. Tuckaway II (essentially a Statesman Tuckaway. plastic pen. GF Trim. Triumph Nib. Five Colors)
11. Lady Sheaffer Type 1 (essentially Sovereign Tuckaway Type 1. Triumph Nib. Bead Band. Five Colors)

12. Lady Sheaffer Type 2 (essentially Sovereign Tuckaway Type 2. Open Nib. Wide Band. Five Colors)
13. Milady (essentially a bead-band Admiral Tuckaway. TRIUMPH nib)

Post War Celluloid Bead band Non-Tuckaway pens which match Tucky's niche: 1945-7

14. Diana * (essentially a Lady Craftsman, a with-clip short pen. 4 colors, maybe not made Gray)
15. Minerva* (essentially a Lady Cadet, a with-clip short pen. 4 colors. maybe not made Gray)

Injection Plastic (Forticel) pre-Touchdown 1948 (evolution of some of the 1945-7 pens, rather than frankly fresh models). Note my 1948 catalogue shows just three colors: black, brown and blue. When were Green and Burgundy introduced?

16. Tuckaway For Your Autograph (Autograph Tucky. Black and BROWN)
17. Crest Tuckaway Deluxe (At least Black Brown Blue, per 1948 catalogue)
18. Sentinel Tuckaway (At least Black Brown Blue, per 1948 catalogue)
19. Valiant Tuckaway
(At least Black Brown Blue, per 1948 catalogue)

20. Tuckaway (renamed from Tuckaway II: essentially a Statesman Tuckaway)
21. (?)Lady Sheaffer (a carryover from the celluloid era Type II Lady Sheaffer, essentially a Sovereign Tuckaway)

(At least Black Brown Blue). Not shown in my 1948 list. But, have I seen the actual pen?

22. gold-filled ballpoint Stratowriter Tuckaway (no fountain pen equivalent)

----- apparently the short-form bead band pens both Tuckaway and non-Tuckaway were discontinued by the end of the celluloid run, so no more Type 1 Lady Sheaffer, Milady, Diana and Minerva---

Touchdown 1949-50 (colors and names yet to be finalized)

23. Tuckaway For Your Autograph (Autograph Tuckaway):
24. Crest Tuckaway Deluxe
25. Sentinel Tuckaway

26.
?? Valiant Tuckaway??? (
not shown in one 1949 list),
27. Tuckaway
.
Essentially a Statesman Tuckaway with large open nib, noting "Statesman" as of 1949 is an open nib full size pen, instead of a slightly slender (vs Valiant) Triumph-nib pen. Note that the 1948 injection-plastic Tuckaway-- itself a renamed Tuckaway II from 1945-7 style-- has Triumph nib)

----------------------------------------------------------

Couple key Conflicts and Pearls (Mostly involving post-war celluloid era 1945-7:
  • 1947 catalogue lists 1 color for Autograph Tuckaway... Black. The retrospective parts section however cites all five colors manufactured. I have seen Black and Brown. Do the other colors exist as Autograph in the post-war celluloid era?
  • The only post-war celluloid Tucky to have open nib was the 2nd form of Lady Sheaffer, which as-- essentially-- a Sovereign Tuckaway, mirrored the painful evolution of Sovereign from a bead band triumph nib pen to wide-lip open nib pen.
  • While post-war celluloid Crest (gold-filled cap) and Sentinel (steel cap) were made each two sizes with model name tweaks (large Crest Deluxe $17.50, smaller Crest $15, large Sentinel Deluxe $15, smaller Sentinel $12.50), only one size Tuckaway appears to have been made for each cap type. Crest Deluxe Tuckaway cost $17.50, and Sentinel (non Deluxe) ran $12.50
  • 1948 catalogue (injection plastic. still plunger fill) shows three solid colors: black, brown, blue. I need to clarify if green and burgundy appeared that year or are Touchdown-only colors.
  • More to follow no doubt

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Email: isaacson@frontiernet.net

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